October 1, 2011
Lies, Damn Lies and Photoshop | TimParkinson.net September 30th, 2011 A fellow skeptic (President of the Granite State Skeptics Travis Roy) recently posted a request on the Skeptoid mailing list regarding an image that has been making the rounds on Facebook. The image is an aerial shot of a supposedly huge turnout for the Occupy Wall St protest against corruption and greed. What appears to be thousands of protesters clog the streets of New York near the City Hall, with a caption stating: Occupy Wall Street Turnout: My TV says nothing. The only thing I hear is its [sic] a small 100 person turn out. Turn off your TV. Ask your friends. Dont [sic] trust the media they lie! My skeptical colleague saw this image and immediately smelled something fishy. Travis noticed that the image was an aerial photo of New York City Hall, whereas the protests were happening several blocks away at Liberty Square. He sent the image to the mailing list for other opinions. To my eyes the mass of protesters looked out of place, the crowd looked too uniform and dense to be real. I took the image into Photoshop to see if I could pick up any pattern to the image. My original thought was that they had used the clone tool to make a smaller group of people look much larger. Not being able to find anything obvious, I started to wonder where the background plate may have come from. Immediately Google Maps came to mind. I looked up the location featured in the image, and then I saw it:  Look familiar? How about now: According to Google Earth, this particular aerial photograph of City Hall was taken on the 3rd of June, 2011, one month before the Occupy Wall Street initiative even began. I have no strong opinions regarding what these people are protesting about. I’m sure they believe their cause is just and I respect their right to make a stand. I do however find it supremely ironic that a group who is supposedly protesting about corruption and lies would produce such a blatant piece of propaganda. Especially one so readily falsifiable. I respect that people have their own opinions and beliefs, however I have no respect for those who blatantly lie to defend their beliefs. “Don’t trust the media. They Lie!” Indeed. * * * 38 Responses to “Lies, Damn Lies and Photoshop” Jason Loxton October 1, 2011 at 1:28 am Hmmm… Did protestors actually make or promote this image? (If not, the criticism is unjust.) The tag on the doctored photo is a URL for a graphic designer in Vancouver. I smell a cynical PR move. Create viral image, have it debunked (or not). Either way, every forward is advertising. http://wettstein.ca/ http://www.jasonwettstein.com/ Travis Roy October 1, 2011 at 1:56 am @Jason – Regardless of the intent, when I saw it this morning it had been shared over 50 times on facebook by, mostly, Occupy Wall Street supporters who took the image as real. I’ve posted it on twitter with the hashtag #occupywallst asking what people thought of it with zero response from anybody on it. So supporters of the cause are promoting it, with nobody saying it doesn’t represent the protest in any way (at least not yet) Matt October 1, 2011 at 9:49 am I’ve been making the point all day, and I support the occupy wall street movement. I’ve been infuriated at the promotion of this falsity because I support the protest. Tim Parkinson October 1, 2011 at 1:40 am A valid point. I don’t know if Wettstein created the image or what his connection to the protests is. However somebody created the image with the intent to mislead people as to the extent of the protests. The “Occupy Wall Street Turnout” caption is pretty unambiguous. Whether it was done as a PR stunt to provoke a reaction I don’t know, but its certainly a possibility. Jason Loxton October 1, 2011 at 1:58 am I emailed Jason Wettstien to ask what was up. My guess it that this image was produced for no political reason at all. Just fun or advertising. But it has been picked up by us skeptics quickly, and the criticism clearly moves beyond a debunking of the image, e.g., you state “I do however find it supremely ironic that a group who is supposedly protesting about corruption and lies would produce such a blatant piece of propaganda.” This is a great piece of viral photo debunking (well done!), but as skeptics we need to stick to the facts: I have not seen any evidence that this was produced by protesters (or counter protestors for that matter). Travis Roy October 1, 2011 at 2:01 am I also emailed Jason but have not heard back. But given the message on the photo, it’s kind of clear where the person stands on the protest. Jason Wettstein, near as I can tell, lives on the West coast of Canada so wouldn’t have any direct knowledge of what’s going on. I’ve talked to friends that live in NYC and they have had no disruption of travel in that area, no roads are blocked. Tim Parkinson October 1, 2011 at 2:09 am You’re right in that we do not yet know who produced the image or for what purpose. It’s possible that Jason Wettstein (or some other individual) produced it and distributed it just for laughs, or some other unknown purpose. However the fact that its being propagated by protesters and supporters without any questioning of its validity is why Travis and I decided to determine its accuracy. It certainly seems like its intent is to exaggerate the extent of the protests, and people are reposting it without once stopping to question the reality of it. Jason Loxton October 1, 2011 at 2:07 am I don’t think it *is* clear where this person stands. That message is designed to ensure forwarding. Since he has his website on it, that’s in his best interest even if he is totally apolitical. On the other hand, he could be a Neocon trying to undermine the anti-Wallstreet protests with an obvious hoax. Or he could be one unscrupulous ideologue naively trying to boost the protest. I don’t think we have any way or knowing, and, as skeptics, any right guessing. But even in the worst case, unless it can be linked to organizers, this in no way maligns a movement, just one guy. Travis Roy October 1, 2011 at 2:17 am I don’t think we made any guesses. There was nothing that said this was anything official from the protest organizers, of course the Occupy Wall Street website says “Occupy Wall Street is leaderless resistance movement with people of many colors, genders and political persuasions.” So they don’t have any real way to “officially” send out information or denounce it. They have had the opportunity to denounce it as individual members of this protest, yet nobody has done so. It also continues to be propagated out as fact through social networking. We were just debunking the image and showing it as a fake. g October 1, 2011 at 3:18 pm ‘they’ had the opportunity to debunk it, but didn’t? did you send it directly to ‘them’ so you can be sure they know about it? anyone following #occupywallst probably sees a hell of a lot of new tweets anytime they check, and might not catch every single tweet that goes out i got to this post via FB from someone who shares #ows stuff, so obviously some of #they are pointing out – but apparently ‘nobody’ has? apparently the condemnations here are a bit overdone… Jason Loxton October 1, 2011 at 2:11 am Just to be clear, once again: Well done on the actual debunking! Great job! (My concern was just on the overreach on interpretation.) Dan Buskirk October 1, 2011 at 2:38 am I’ve been deluged with posts about the protest and I never saw this. Who knows who made this and why but it seems pretty irrelevant to what is going on out there. Travis Roy October 1, 2011 at 3:36 am Reply from the image creator is in: “yes its photoshopped I was hyping the event lol you do know the news is lying to us all day long. So they have CNN and Fox the 99% have me lol Sincerely, Jason Wettstein” Travis Roy October 1, 2011 at 3:58 am So I replied. “So they lie, it’s okay for you to lie?” His reply to that: ” Yes!! I would do anything to help fight the elites and banksters. I feel overstating the turnout when it is being ignored by the mainstream media might inspire people to head on down. My take is the world is on its deathbed I would lie cheat, steal and murder to save my daughter a place on this planet these banksters are destroying for imaginary profits. You can make this an issue but when the food runs out I am eating you. Sincerely, Jason Wettstein” Jason Loxton October 1, 2011 at 4:30 am That is an extremely unfortunate response. Deeply disappointing. The irony is he is setting up the movement he is trying to help. Tim Parkinson October 1, 2011 at 3:47 am Well there you have it. It doesn’t change the fact that people are reposting the image seemingly believing it to be real. The motivations of the originator of the image are irrelevant when they are unknown to those down the chain. Wettstein is also committing a classic “Two Wrongs” fallacy; The media and government lies to us, therefore its okay for us to lie as well. It’s hard to hold the moral high ground while doing the same things as your opponent. Travis Roy October 1, 2011 at 3:51 am Couldn’t agree more. Jason Wettstein October 1, 2011 at 4:05 am yes its photoshopped I was hyping the event lol you do know the news is lying to us all day long. So they have CNN and Fox the 99% have me lol My intention was all good, to inspire people that is all maybe a little lie but we all live with thousands of huge media lies with no good intentions. I know many more people would be there if the could. I would personally would do anything to help fight the elites and banksters. I feel overstating the turnout when it is being ignored by the mainstream media might inspire people to head on down. I would be there if I could as I am sure millions would but these wall street cunts have us slaving just to eat and live with out the freedom to be there. My take is the world is on its deathbed and I would lie cheat, steal, murder and or give my life to save my daughter a place and a healthy future on this planet these banksters are destroying for imaginary profits and what are we going to do? People can make this an issue but when the food runs out I am eating them. SocraticGadfly October 1, 2011 at 9:48 am In other words, you’ve admitted you’re untrustworthy not just now, but in general. Why would I want to march beside you, in either actuality or in spirit? Jason Wettstein October 1, 2011 at 4:31 am “Lying to get your point across makes you no better than them and causes people to mistrust the protest’s motives and goals. I know of a few people that now no longer support the Occupy Wall Street protest due the the deception you have shown. – Travis Roy” Travis if you “I know of a few people that now no longer support the Occupy Wall Street protest due the the deception you have shown.” then you know people that never supported this cause. I am sure rapist and child murderers support saving the planet and they will not waiver my support. Looking for all the things we don’t have in common rather than all the things we do is how you let them win its the old divide and conquer. I sugest you are an jerk off who would argue with your self and you are a vampire sucking the life out of anything you can. Maybe a over paid disruptive? You will use what ever you can to drag down the hope of these people I am suggesting people ignore losers like you and your weak minded flip flop supporters. here is the truth the photo and Travis Roy are both massive fakes but the photo was here to inspire you and Travis Roy is here for his ego! Jason. g October 1, 2011 at 3:21 pm Jason – i prefer to get my inspiration elsewhere, better sources you might say, thank you very much. but to each, their own… i’m not changing my mind about the ruling financial elite just cause some guy out in vancouver photoshopped an image, but i’m not applauding either Jason Loxton October 1, 2011 at 4:38 am Jason, You do realize that in creating a false image that will be promoted within the community you claim to support, you are ultimately undermining the credibility of that movement, right? I can actually think of few things you could do to better sabotage and distract from their “we the people stand en masse” message. I suspect that this whole thing is a prank on your part, and that your comment here is further trolling, but if not, a giant, disappointed, and sarcastic “well done” to you. : ( Jeff Wagg October 1, 2011 at 4:45 am “If they’re lying to us, we can lie to us better!!!” Lying is a very bad way to support a cause, and the excuses given for doing so by Jason Wettstein are pathetic. Thanks to Travis and Tim for pointing out this ruse, and let the protests stand or fall on their own merits without consideration regarding this unfortunate piece of propaganda. Jason Wettstein October 1, 2011 at 5:11 am “trolling” You guys are the definition of trolls maybe you can read my post again apparently you did not understand what I meant. With all the things to do in this world, with all the injustice, what is really sad is this is what you find your useless self-righteous sheepish selves doing. You are trolls with vampire powers and I have a real life so as much fun as this is for you I will not attend your troll sucking feast any further. Jason Wettstein October 1, 2011 at 5:14 am OH i could not help but notice the Royal Bank Banners on your page now I am sure they are rotating and GEO targeted and different for everyone but I think this is very funny in a “sad” way Tim Parkinson October 1, 2011 at 12:05 pm That is rather amusing. Jason Wettstein October 1, 2011 at 5:52 am https://www.facebook.com/notes/new-world-opposition/wavering-wall-street-protesters-are-not-protesters-they-are-sheople/163177047102307 al October 1, 2011 at 6:02 am There will always be people like Jason who feel justified in stretching the truth in favor of a good cause. It behooves all of us to be skeptical of what we hear–if the truth needs stretching, perhaps we’re on the wrong side. Regardless of which side you’re talking about. Kitty October 1, 2011 at 7:43 am A few small things, since we’re all being investigative and all. Jason Wettstein lives in Canada, he is neither at the Occupy Wall Street protests nor associated with them in any way. He’s one frustrated guy far away whose ‘shoop got picked up. Presenting this as if it in any way represents the views of the people who are associated with the protest is a bit intellectually dishonest. “But they haven’t soundly trounced it!” No, they haven’t yet. But not denying something is not the same as supporting it. Or you haven’t seen any denials because you’re getting your info from a removed source. Every day someone is posting some nonsense in the name of atheism or skepticism and it gets ignored. Mostly because stupid pranks/opinions aren’t worth the time. You’re asking the event coordinators to prove a negative “When did you stop promoting this photo which you didn’t create or toss out into the ‘nets.” SocraticGadfly October 1, 2011 at 8:31 am @Jason … ends do NOT justify the means. Period. End of story. That said, with Adbusters involved (more ppl there are “look at me” types disgruntled over not getting top ad agency jobs than real left liberals, IMO – an opinion I’ve had more than a decade) this does NOT surprise me. Richard Murray October 1, 2011 at 9:08 am Jason: How is that funny? Royal Bank wasn’t a bailed out bank. Jason Wettstein October 1, 2011 at 2:50 pm fuck all of you your a bunch of NAZI Trolls making rules for how I should conduct my self and how others should FUCK YOU I would rather keep the fuck heads I know then replace them with you losers. I am just as much a protester of the people down on the streets I have done maybe even more with email, blogging and posts then all of you opinionated wankers. All you cunts have done is prove your ignorance this protest is not a US protest or US movement its global. Kitty what are you 12 its not up to them or you to censor my right to expression Its a fake so fucking what I could point out 100 other fakes but I would hate to have people leave the protest LOL GET A FUCKING GRIP! Honestly you are a bunch of clowns no wonder they are laughing with morons like you dividing the few supporters there are and scaring off others on the fence. Fuck adbusters LOSERS and WANNA BE’S and fuck any other people and groups that think they can own me. I am protesting cunts and Banksters hording the wealth of the world and the elite ruling class. I don’t belong to any group I am the other 99% the 99% that does not have you rule book! You can fuck off if you don’t like my fake photo OK! I think that the fake yielded great results and inspired people and for those that have had a change of heart because of these or maybe dont want to be involved because of a few fake photos FUCK THEM. I posted all you bitching and moaning only had 2 comments tell me what useless twats you were and the other that you were all art school grads with no work. I think you are all idiots and yes you anger me I fucking would rather have the flu then meet any of you chumps. Now I really hope you will just stop antagonizing me I had no intentions on ruining your private protest so FUCK OFF PLEASE. Tim Parkinson October 1, 2011 at 3:09 pm I’m pretty sure if I was an art school graduate I would have put a little more time into the graphic than I did, but thank you for your concern regarding my employment status. There is no need to get nasty. That rant has earned yourself a ban from the comments. I will however leave your final remarks online so that people can see what kind of person you are. Good luck with overthrowing global financial tyranny. Travis Roy October 1, 2011 at 6:00 pm “Now I really hope you will just stop antagonizing me I had no intentions on ruining your private protest so FUCK OFF PLEASE.” Nobody is forcing you to come here. No reason to be upset that some people figured out the fraud you were trying to perpetuate on the internet and now even your supporters online that were once sharing this image are reporting that it’s a fake and don’t support it. If you did some research and created an image that had the protestors in the correct location, and didn’t exaggerate the numbers so much, people wouldn’t have noticed. Travis Roy October 1, 2011 at 8:18 pm I wanted to give an update. It seems that whenever somebody is posting the photo, people are jumping on it to expose it as a fake and let people know. I see this as a positive sign for the truth and for the credibility of this protest regardless of your feelings about them. Tim Parkinson October 1, 2011 at 9:22 pm Great to hear. I’d like to thank everyone who has contributed to spreading the word about this thing. The sooner the facts are revealed about this kind of thing the sooner everyone can get back to providing credible coverage of this event. John Atkeison October 2, 2011 at 12:05 am Thanks for this work. To me, it smells like the work of the old “Rat Fuckers” in the Nixon White House, including “Jason’s” response. I could also be quite genuine, of course. Last year when I lived in New Orleans an acquaintance gage me a bumper sticker that read something like, “Think Green! Vote all incumbents out!” The group identified on the peel-off backing turned out to be a Tea Party group. IMHO, all this argues for transparency and a common standard of behavior which would include honesty. IMHO, you can try to trick the enemy, but never your friends or comrades. If someone or some organization plays games with people, they risk becoming indistinguishable from our enemy. robin October 2, 2011 at 3:35 am I reposted this after seeing it again this morning. I did think the cabs in the center of the street was weird, but I did repost it… because I live in Madison WI and was part of the protests in Feb and March and it was constantly underreported and the crowd estimates were greatly diminished.. by the 10s of thousands, so that is what made me bite on this. But after seeing this, and a friend pointing it out, I quickly posted your image and the comments! I want the TRUTH. I am for the TRUTH. The person who did this is naive to his leaving an opening for these vampires to suck the real truth out and use it as a wedge to bring doubt to people hoping so hard to fight against this terrible take over of our government by the ‘bankers’ or the Koch brothers and their ilk. It is true, it is happening. ALEC is writing legislation. Corporations have been deemed ‘Citizens’ by the highest court in the land. This is real. So I am ALWAYS unafraid to say I’ve been duped by someone, but the cause is just and I will fight on. Thanks for shedding light on this.

Lies, Damn Lies and Photoshop | TimParkinson.net

September 30th, 2011

A fellow skeptic (President of the Granite State Skeptics Travis Roy) recently posted a request on the Skeptoid mailing list regarding an image that has been making the rounds on Facebook. The image is an aerial shot of a supposedly huge turnout for the Occupy Wall St protest against corruption and greed. What appears to be thousands of protesters clog the streets of New York near the City Hall, with a caption stating:

Occupy Wall Street Turnout: My TV says nothing. The only thing I hear is its [sic] a small 100 person turn out. Turn off your TV. Ask your friends. Dont [sic] trust the media they lie!


My skeptical colleague saw this image and immediately smelled something fishy. Travis noticed that the image was an aerial photo of New York City Hall, whereas the protests were happening several blocks away at Liberty Square. He sent the image to the mailing list for other opinions. To my eyes the mass of protesters looked out of place, the crowd looked too uniform and dense to be real. I took the image into Photoshop to see if I could pick up any pattern to the image. My original thought was that they had used the clone tool to make a smaller group of people look much larger. Not being able to find anything obvious, I started to wonder where the background plate may have come from. Immediately Google Maps came to mind. I looked up the location featured in the image, and then I saw it: 

Look familiar? How about now:

According to Google Earth, this particular aerial photograph of City Hall was taken on the 3rd of June, 2011, one month before the Occupy Wall Street initiative even began.

I have no strong opinions regarding what these people are protesting about. I’m sure they believe their cause is just and I respect their right to make a stand. I do however find it supremely ironic that a group who is supposedly protesting about corruption and lies would produce such a blatant piece of propaganda. Especially one so readily falsifiable. I respect that people have their own opinions and beliefs, however I have no respect for those who blatantly lie to defend their beliefs.

“Don’t trust the media. They Lie!”

Indeed.

* * *

38 Responses to “Lies, Damn Lies and Photoshop”

  • Jason Loxton October 1, 2011 at 1:28 am

    Hmmm… Did protestors actually make or promote this image? (If not, the criticism is unjust.) The tag on the doctored photo is a URL for a graphic designer in Vancouver. I smell a cynical PR move. Create viral image, have it debunked (or not). Either way, every forward is advertising. http://wettstein.ca/ http://www.jasonwettstein.com/

    • Travis Roy October 1, 2011 at 1:56 am

      @Jason – Regardless of the intent, when I saw it this morning it had been shared over 50 times on facebook by, mostly, Occupy Wall Street supporters who took the image as real. I’ve posted it on twitter with the hashtag #occupywallst asking what people thought of it with zero response from anybody on it.

      So supporters of the cause are promoting it, with nobody saying it doesn’t represent the protest in any way (at least not yet)

      • Matt October 1, 2011 at 9:49 am

        I’ve been making the point all day, and I support the occupy wall street movement. I’ve been infuriated at the promotion of this falsity because I support the protest.

  • Tim Parkinson October 1, 2011 at 1:40 am

    A valid point. I don’t know if Wettstein created the image or what his connection to the protests is. However somebody created the image with the intent to mislead people as to the extent of the protests. The “Occupy Wall Street Turnout” caption is pretty unambiguous. Whether it was done as a PR stunt to provoke a reaction I don’t know, but its certainly a possibility.

  • Jason Loxton October 1, 2011 at 1:58 am

    I emailed Jason Wettstien to ask what was up. My guess it that this image was produced for no political reason at all. Just fun or advertising. But it has been picked up by us skeptics quickly, and the criticism clearly moves beyond a debunking of the image, e.g., you state “I do however find it supremely ironic that a group who is supposedly protesting about corruption and lies would produce such a blatant piece of propaganda.”

    This is a great piece of viral photo debunking (well done!), but as skeptics we need to stick to the facts: I have not seen any evidence that this was produced by protesters (or counter protestors for that matter).

    • Travis Roy October 1, 2011 at 2:01 am

      I also emailed Jason but have not heard back. But given the message on the photo, it’s kind of clear where the person stands on the protest. Jason Wettstein, near as I can tell, lives on the West coast of Canada so wouldn’t have any direct knowledge of what’s going on. I’ve talked to friends that live in NYC and they have had no disruption of travel in that area, no roads are blocked.

    • Tim Parkinson October 1, 2011 at 2:09 am

      You’re right in that we do not yet know who produced the image or for what purpose. It’s possible that Jason Wettstein (or some other individual) produced it and distributed it just for laughs, or some other unknown purpose. However the fact that its being propagated by protesters and supporters without any questioning of its validity is why Travis and I decided to determine its accuracy. It certainly seems like its intent is to exaggerate the extent of the protests, and people are reposting it without once stopping to question the reality of it.

  • Jason Loxton October 1, 2011 at 2:07 am

    I don’t think it *is* clear where this person stands. That message is designed to ensure forwarding. Since he has his website on it, that’s in his best interest even if he is totally apolitical. On the other hand, he could be a Neocon trying to undermine the anti-Wallstreet protests with an obvious hoax. Or he could be one unscrupulous ideologue naively trying to boost the protest. I don’t think we have any way or knowing, and, as skeptics, any right guessing. But even in the worst case, unless it can be linked to organizers, this in no way maligns a movement, just one guy.

    • Travis Roy October 1, 2011 at 2:17 am

      I don’t think we made any guesses. There was nothing that said this was anything official from the protest organizers, of course the Occupy Wall Street website says “Occupy Wall Street is leaderless resistance movement with people of many colors, genders and political persuasions.” So they don’t have any real way to “officially” send out information or denounce it.

      They have had the opportunity to denounce it as individual members of this protest, yet nobody has done so. It also continues to be propagated out as fact through social networking. We were just debunking the image and showing it as a fake.

      • g October 1, 2011 at 3:18 pm

        ‘they’ had the opportunity to debunk it, but didn’t?
        did you send it directly to ‘them’ so you can be sure they know about it?
        anyone following #occupywallst probably sees a hell of a lot of new tweets anytime they check, and might not catch every single tweet that goes out

        i got to this post via FB from someone who shares #ows stuff, so obviously some of #they are pointing out – but apparently ‘nobody’ has?

        apparently the condemnations here are a bit overdone…

  • Jason Loxton October 1, 2011 at 2:11 am

    Just to be clear, once again: Well done on the actual debunking! Great job! (My concern was just on the overreach on interpretation.)

  • Dan Buskirk October 1, 2011 at 2:38 am

    I’ve been deluged with posts about the protest and I never saw this. Who knows who made this and why but it seems pretty irrelevant to what is going on out there.

  • Travis Roy October 1, 2011 at 3:36 am

    Reply from the image creator is in:

    “yes its photoshopped I was hyping the event lol you do know the news is lying to us all day long. So they have CNN and Fox the 99% have me lol

    Sincerely,

    Jason Wettstein”

    • Travis Roy October 1, 2011 at 3:58 am

      So I replied. “So they lie, it’s okay for you to lie?”

      His reply to that:

      ” Yes!!

      I would do anything to help fight the elites and banksters. I feel overstating the turnout when it is being ignored by the mainstream media might inspire people to head on down.

      My take is the world is on its deathbed I would lie cheat, steal and murder to save my daughter a place on this planet these banksters are destroying for imaginary profits.

      You can make this an issue but when the food runs out I am eating you.

      Sincerely,

      Jason Wettstein”

      • Jason Loxton October 1, 2011 at 4:30 am

        That is an extremely unfortunate response. Deeply disappointing. The irony is he is setting up the movement he is trying to help.

  • Tim Parkinson October 1, 2011 at 3:47 am

    Well there you have it. It doesn’t change the fact that people are reposting the image seemingly believing it to be real. The motivations of the originator of the image are irrelevant when they are unknown to those down the chain. Wettstein is also committing a classic “Two Wrongs” fallacy; The media and government lies to us, therefore its okay for us to lie as well. It’s hard to hold the moral high ground while doing the same things as your opponent.

  • Jason Wettstein October 1, 2011 at 4:05 am

    yes its photoshopped I was hyping the event lol you do know the news is lying to us all day long. So they have CNN and Fox the 99% have me lol

    My intention was all good, to inspire people that is all maybe a little lie but we all live with thousands of huge media lies with no good intentions. I know many more people would be there if the could.

    I would personally would do anything to help fight the elites and banksters. I feel overstating the turnout when it is being ignored by the mainstream media might inspire people to head on down. I would be there if I could as I am sure millions would but these wall street cunts have us slaving just to eat and live with out the freedom to be there.

    My take is the world is on its deathbed and I would lie cheat, steal, murder and or give my life to save my daughter a place and a healthy future on this planet these banksters are destroying for imaginary profits and what are we going to do?

    People can make this an issue but when the food runs out I am eating them.

  • Jason Wettstein October 1, 2011 at 4:31 am

    “Lying to get your point across makes you no better than them and
    causes people to mistrust the protest’s motives and goals.

    I know of a few people that now no longer support the Occupy Wall
    Street protest due the the deception you have shown.

    –
    Travis Roy”

    Travis if you “I know of a few people that now no longer support the Occupy Wall
    Street protest due the the deception you have shown.” then you know people that never supported this cause. I am sure rapist and child murderers support saving the planet and they will not waiver my support.

    Looking for all the things we don’t have in common rather than all the things we do is how you let them win its the old divide and conquer.

    I sugest you are an jerk off who would argue with your self and you are a vampire sucking the life out of anything you can. Maybe a over paid disruptive?

    You will use what ever you can to drag down the hope of these people I am suggesting people ignore losers like you and your weak minded flip flop supporters.

    here is the truth the photo and Travis Roy are both massive fakes but the photo was here to inspire you and Travis Roy is here for his ego!

    Jason.

    • g October 1, 2011 at 3:21 pm

      Jason – i prefer to get my inspiration elsewhere, better sources you might say, thank you very much. but to each, their own… i’m not changing my mind about the ruling financial elite just cause some guy out in vancouver photoshopped an image, but i’m not applauding either

  • Jason Loxton October 1, 2011 at 4:38 am

    Jason,

    You do realize that in creating a false image that will be promoted within the community you claim to support, you are ultimately undermining the credibility of that movement, right? I can actually think of few things you could do to better sabotage and distract from their “we the people stand en masse” message. I suspect that this whole thing is a prank on your part, and that your comment here is further trolling, but if not, a giant, disappointed, and sarcastic “well done” to you. : (

  • Jeff Wagg October 1, 2011 at 4:45 am

    “If they’re lying to us, we can lie to us better!!!”

    Lying is a very bad way to support a cause, and the excuses given for doing so by Jason Wettstein are pathetic.

    Thanks to Travis and Tim for pointing out this ruse, and let the protests stand or fall on their own merits without consideration regarding this unfortunate piece of propaganda.

  • Jason Wettstein October 1, 2011 at 5:11 am

    “trolling”

    You guys are the definition of trolls maybe you can read my post again apparently you did not understand what I meant.

    With all the things to do in this world, with all the injustice, what is really sad is this is what you find your useless self-righteous sheepish selves doing.

    You are trolls with vampire powers and I have a real life so as much fun as this is for you I will not attend your troll sucking feast any further.

  • Jason Wettstein October 1, 2011 at 5:14 am

    OH i could not help but notice the Royal Bank Banners on your page now I am sure they are rotating and GEO targeted and different for everyone but I think this is very funny in a “sad” way

  • Jason Wettstein October 1, 2011 at 5:52 am

    https://www.facebook.com/notes/new-world-opposition/wavering-wall-street-protesters-are-not-protesters-they-are-sheople/163177047102307

  • al October 1, 2011 at 6:02 am

    There will always be people like Jason who feel justified in stretching the truth in favor of a good cause. It behooves all of us to be skeptical of what we hear–if the truth needs stretching, perhaps we’re on the wrong side. Regardless of which side you’re talking about.

  • Kitty October 1, 2011 at 7:43 am

    A few small things, since we’re all being investigative and all. Jason Wettstein lives in Canada, he is neither at the Occupy Wall Street protests nor associated with them in any way. He’s one frustrated guy far away whose ‘shoop got picked up.

    Presenting this as if it in any way represents the views of the people who are associated with the protest is a bit intellectually dishonest. “But they haven’t soundly trounced it!” No, they haven’t yet. But not denying something is not the same as supporting it. Or you haven’t seen any denials because you’re getting your info from a removed source. Every day someone is posting some nonsense in the name of atheism or skepticism and it gets ignored. Mostly because stupid pranks/opinions aren’t worth the time. You’re asking the event coordinators to prove a negative “When did you stop promoting this photo which you didn’t create or toss out into the ‘nets.”

  • SocraticGadfly October 1, 2011 at 8:31 am

    @Jason … ends do NOT justify the means. Period. End of story. That said, with Adbusters involved (more ppl there are “look at me” types disgruntled over not getting top ad agency jobs than real left liberals, IMO – an opinion I’ve had more than a decade) this does NOT surprise me.

  • Richard Murray October 1, 2011 at 9:08 am

    Jason:

    How is that funny? Royal Bank wasn’t a bailed out bank.

  • Jason Wettstein October 1, 2011 at 2:50 pm

    fuck all of you your a bunch of NAZI Trolls making rules for how I should conduct my self and how others should FUCK YOU I would rather keep the fuck heads I know then replace them with you losers. I am just as much a protester of the people down on the streets I have done maybe even more with email, blogging and posts then all of you opinionated wankers. All you cunts have done is prove your ignorance this protest is not a US protest or US movement its global. Kitty what are you 12 its not up to them or you to censor my right to expression Its a fake so fucking what I could point out 100 other fakes but I would hate to have people leave the protest LOL GET A FUCKING GRIP!

    Honestly you are a bunch of clowns no wonder they are laughing with morons like you dividing the few supporters there are and scaring off others on the fence.

    Fuck adbusters LOSERS and WANNA BE’S and fuck any other people and groups that think they can own me. I am protesting cunts and Banksters hording the wealth of the world and the elite ruling class. I don’t belong to any group I am the other 99% the 99% that does not have you rule book! You can fuck off if you don’t like my fake photo OK! I think that the fake yielded great results and inspired people and for those that have had a change of heart because of these or maybe dont want to be involved because of a few fake photos FUCK THEM.

    I posted all you bitching and moaning only had 2 comments tell me what useless twats you were and the other that you were all art school grads with no work.

    I think you are all idiots and yes you anger me I fucking would rather have the flu then meet any of you chumps.

    Now I really hope you will just stop antagonizing me I had no intentions on ruining your private protest so FUCK OFF PLEASE.

    • Tim Parkinson October 1, 2011 at 3:09 pm

      I’m pretty sure if I was an art school graduate I would have put a little more time into the graphic than I did, but thank you for your concern regarding my employment status.

      There is no need to get nasty. That rant has earned yourself a ban from the comments. I will however leave your final remarks online so that people can see what kind of person you are. Good luck with overthrowing global financial tyranny.

    • Travis Roy October 1, 2011 at 6:00 pm

      “Now I really hope you will just stop antagonizing me I had no intentions on ruining your private protest so FUCK OFF PLEASE.”

      Nobody is forcing you to come here. No reason to be upset that some people figured out the fraud you were trying to perpetuate on the internet and now even your supporters online that were once sharing this image are reporting that it’s a fake and don’t support it.

      If you did some research and created an image that had the protestors in the correct location, and didn’t exaggerate the numbers so much, people wouldn’t have noticed.

  • Travis Roy October 1, 2011 at 8:18 pm

    I wanted to give an update. It seems that whenever somebody is posting the photo, people are jumping on it to expose it as a fake and let people know. I see this as a positive sign for the truth and for the credibility of this protest regardless of your feelings about them.

    • Tim Parkinson October 1, 2011 at 9:22 pm

      Great to hear. I’d like to thank everyone who has contributed to spreading the word about this thing. The sooner the facts are revealed about this kind of thing the sooner everyone can get back to providing credible coverage of this event.

  • John Atkeison October 2, 2011 at 12:05 am

    Thanks for this work. To me, it smells like the work of the old “Rat Fuckers” in the Nixon White House, including “Jason’s” response. I could also be quite genuine, of course.

    Last year when I lived in New Orleans an acquaintance gage me a bumper sticker that read something like, “Think Green! Vote all incumbents out!” The group identified on the peel-off backing turned out to be a Tea Party group.

    IMHO, all this argues for transparency and a common standard of behavior which would include honesty. IMHO, you can try to trick the enemy, but never your friends or comrades.

    If someone or some organization plays games with people, they risk becoming indistinguishable from our enemy.

  • robin October 2, 2011 at 3:35 am

    I reposted this after seeing it again this morning. I did think the cabs in the center of the street was weird, but I did repost it… because I live in Madison WI and was part of the protests in Feb and March and it was constantly underreported and the crowd estimates were greatly diminished.. by the 10s of thousands, so that is what made me bite on this. But after seeing this, and a friend pointing it out, I quickly posted your image and the comments! I want the TRUTH. I am for the TRUTH. The person who did this is naive to his leaving an opening for these vampires to suck the real truth out and use it as a wedge to bring doubt to people hoping so hard to fight against this terrible take over of our government by the ‘bankers’ or the Koch brothers and their ilk. It is true, it is happening. ALEC is writing legislation. Corporations have been deemed ‘Citizens’ by the highest court in the land. This is real. So I am ALWAYS unafraid to say I’ve been duped by someone, but the cause is just and I will fight on. Thanks for shedding light on this.

10:10pm  |   URL: http://tmblr.co/ZK1xOyA9opJI
(Notes: 48)
  
  1. donetta-holmes reblogged this from higginst
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  5. northernskies reblogged this from slightly and added:
    I actually do have opinions about this (AKA I totally get what they’re doing…) and I’d like to hear more about what...
  6. lizthedrummer reblogged this from mercurypdx and added:
    I have not fact checked this FYI.
  7. prettygirlwithahandgrenade reblogged this from gravyholocaust and added:
    I think the lesson we can learn here is “Fucking EVERYBODY lies.” Shit, y’all.
  8. slightly reblogged this from mercurypdx
  9. pisscellany reblogged this from gravyholocaust
  10. mercurypdx reblogged this from gravyholocaust
  11. gravyholocaust reblogged this from cthulhucore
  12. higginst reblogged this from cthulhucore and added:
    The photo did strike me as odd, but I support the message in the image nonetheless. Turn off your goddamn televisions...
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  14. voyeurismisparticipation reblogged this from androphilia
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  20. cauldronsofreverb said: This is alarming. I’m showing all of my friends. The comment about Ratfucking and raising a False-flag are interesting. that may be the case. that would be really slimey if it were though.
  21. androphilia posted this